aftertherockets

allow me to clarify
I'm all about women's power and I think women are great, and I think they should be equal to men, because well... we are equal.
what I don't agree with is the crazies who make men out to be some beast and who act like women are supreme and all-powerful and that all men are cheating, womanizing morons. Because they aren't. I also don't agree with women who blame everything wrong in their lives on the fact that they are women and therefor are treated unfairly.
I really am all about the idea behind feminism, just like I am all about spirituality. There are just people who go to extreems and that bugs me.
but whatever. agree to disagree?

also
"I've watched the snow fall from my window, watched it cover the ground as the sun came up, as it turned from black to grey to blue to white. I saw thousands of footprints, betraying every step of every person who came by, no longer allowing their travels to remain invisible."
that's very lovely and poetic. well said ;)

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Well, let me just say that I didn't mean that to be directed at you. Your post is what made me think about it, but it's been popping up around me a lot lately. And I didn't figure you for someone who thinks women should sit at home and knit, which is why I figured I would wait for your poem and then comment. ;)

I'm in a class this semester that centers on feminist literature, so feminism is a topic that's been on my mind a lot lately. And I do believe I will post my own thoughts on it soon, and then we can all have a lively debate and it will be fun, yes? :)

Also, thank you. For the compliment. ;)

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yay! debate!
I didn't think it was necessarily directed at me, but reading back on it, I realized how bad it might sound.
but I do love to knit ;)

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Hehe, and I love cross-stitch. ;)

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I'm anti-feminist. Just read my work on "What Happened to Chivalry?" Yeah, I just don't like femno-nazis. I'm all for women's rights and stuff, but the ppl that want to be just treated better than everyone else annoy me.

Matt's ex was a feminist, so she didn't believe in shaving or deoderant. She thought it was the female opressing society that made women do such things as shave and smell good.... I hope you get my point.
Some of us shave to not look gross, some of us use deoderant to not smell like ass... not because we feel opressed by men.

And what happened to chivalry? Women's equal rights movement, that's what. No more knights on white horses for us. We gonna have to get our own damn horses.

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damn you for being better at articulating exactly what I meant!!!!
;D

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hehe, I try. :)

If anyone wants to read it, here is what I wrote about women libbers... err...

[Error: Irreparable invalid markup ('<a href'"http://www.wam.umd.edu/~bswhite/chivalry.html">') in entry. Owner must fix manually. Raw contents below.]

hehe, I try. :)

If anyone wants to read it, here is what I wrote about women libbers... err... <a href'"http://www.wam.umd.edu/~bswhite/chivalry.html">Femno-Nazis</a>.

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Yeah, I like how my link didn't work.
http://www.wam.umd.edu/~bswhite/chivalry.html

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haha. I'll check that out

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But Bonnie? Do you like the fact that you are getting a college education? Do you enjoy that you don't have to get married or have kids if you don't want to? Do you like that if Bob started being an ass and hitting your or something, you could leave him? Do you enjoy getting paid the same amount of money for doing a job that a man would get paid?

I think you do. And that makes you a feminist. Nothing more, nothing less. Feminists are not by definition man-haters, or not allowed to shave or get married. I am a feminist. I shave all the time. I smell pretty damn good now as I just got out of the shower. I think I would like to get married someday. I would also, however, like to get my degree, and get any job that I would like and get paid the same as a man would.

And personally? I don't need to be rescued by a knight on a white horse. I can and will take care of myself.

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khai

I ain't no damsel in distess and I don't need to be rescued so put me down punk. ;-)

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My thoughts exactly. :)

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saava.livejournal.com

Anti-feminists really bug me, especially when they're female, and I've been hearing and seeing a lot of them around me lately. How can you be a woman in today's society and not be a feminist? It's too late, I'm too tired to espouse any opinions right now, but maybe a post will be forthcoming.

I'd really like to read that post.

Because, yeah, anti-feminists bother me, too. (And oh my god, the term "femi-nazi"? Makes me see red. To even compare feminists to Nazis shows such a great amount of ignorance that it boggles the mind.)

I hate that women can be so vile towards each other. There's an almost prevailing attitude that being a feminist is somehow "wrong." And I hear women all.the.time saying stuff like, "I can't stand other women! They're all bitches!"

Just... gah.

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Oh, totally. The whole femi-nazi thing makes me seethe as well. To compare feminists to people who tried to wipe out an entire race of human beings, well yes, like you said, shows an inane amount of ignorance.

And my mother is one of those people who is always saying "I can't stand other women." It's impossible to get through to her sometimes, to the point where I've almost given up trying. :P

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butterscotch711.livejournal.com

'Anti-feminist' can sometimes mean wanting to step back from feminist discourses as they function currently, like how 'anti-Macintosh' is actually a theory about how PC's could function in a fundamentally different way, and has nothing to do with worshipping Bill Gates.

I know that's not what you're talking about, but sometimes people who wear the 'anti-feminist' label are actually feminists who have particular criticisms of some aspects of feminism - a lot of the time these criticisms are that it has become limited, narrow-minded, dogmatic etc.

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Well, okay, I can accept that. I have no problem with women wanting to step back from certain extreme aspects that have come to be associated with feminism and wanting to be disassociated with them. In fact, I am one of those women. But what I can't except is labelling themselves as anti-feminist, when they are clearly not.

And to be fair, part of that is the way our society looks down on feminism, or dismisses feminists as a bunch of pushy women who hate men. Many women don't want to be associated with that, and so they don't consider themselves feminists. And that demonstrates a level of ignorance that I think needs to be corrected.

And um, it bugs me. :)

From: (Anonymous)

feminists rule me. susan b anthony rocked. that made for tv movie on the women's suffrage movement starring hilary swank rocked. but wouldnt it just be easy if people were trans-sexual and colored some shade of purple? you may now bow to me as the piercing brilliance of my insight blinds you like the setting sun while you are driving. =)

From: (Anonymous)

i was incredibly bored when making that last post. which is why i am reading your post =) bonnie is a butt and sadly, my last message was not sarcastic and i actually like feminists, even the "femi-nazi". i like arguing. also i was notified that trans-gender may be more appropriate than trans-sexual so i recind my previous term in light of the PC climate we must all be aware of in this ridiculous day and age of the patriot act.

~fin~

"Only a fool looks for logic in the chambers of the human heart."

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You should sign your posts. Cause I'm the only one who knows who you are. :P

Also? You are a gianormous dork.

:-D

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I enjoy my freedoms as a woman, but I just feel feminist is a bit of a strong word. If anything, I am an equal rights advocate.

Think about it... Women got the right to vote before blacks. I think we are being a bit selfish in our desire to be equal just as women, so I don't want to single myself out as a single activist. I'm not even an activist. I don't believe in tearing down rainforests, but I don't go walking around with signs saying "Save the rainforest." I think of feminists as those ppl always talking about women's rights and that annoys me just as much as Christians trying to "save" me.

Maybe I am a feminist for just the plain fact of believing in women's rights.

Femno-nazi is a perfect term for those people who are looking to be better than everyone else. Isn't that the point of nazi-ism? I think I am perfectly intelligent enough to make the connection and wish not to be directly attacked for my use of terms. I am not saying that all feminists are femno-nazis.

I like to be independent enough, but I also still believe in the bread-winner society. I grew up to it. I would like to have a husband that will help bring in an income, and I have the choice to work myself to help out. Or I can have kids, which is a big IF cuz I hate kids. I'll stay home and take care of the cats. I still believe in chivalry, and obvioulsy not being beaten by my significant other. But along with feminism came the independence, and out with the chilvary.

Heather should know from some of her readings how much more romantic guys were towards women back in the day. Today we're lucky if our romantic guys take us out to McDonalds. Just 50 years ago there was more chivalry than today! Bah, I say.

From: (Anonymous)

actually blacks had the vote in a crazy way during reconstruction, so technically they got it first then they were excluded by stuff like the grandfather clause.

From: (Anonymous)

and no its not the point of nazism. it isnt about being better, its about others being worse and purification. it wasnt an issue of betterness from their viewpoint, it was an issue of disease, cure and preservation. if the nazis truly thought they were better than the jews, they would not have gone through all the trouble to exterminate them and just let them die out since they are obviously inferior.

instead, everyone feared stuff like the "protocols of the elders of zion" where jews are the ultimate evil and their elders plot and scheme to undermine all world governments to envelop the world in a bunch of jew-doms. Not only did this document spark hitlers drive for power and his coup of the German government, but it also inspired anti-semitism in people like Henry Ford. So I'd say that Hitler actually feared the jews rather than saying they found them inferior. The whole race issue which is often interpreted as a "we are better" campaign, I would posit as misleading. Since better from the Nazi standpoint is in the sense of purity of essence and that the jews were instruments of pure evil. but since they needed to find more support of this, they brought into the fray the inferiority issue and a eugenic purpose for the ultimate solution. still really bored. =)

From: (Anonymous)

ergo, it wasnt rooted in better, it was rooted in fear. but i suppose with that you could argue the chicken or the egg...

im a masculinist. i want to be treated just as dainty as any girl. and the fact that chivalry only goes one way is rooted in neanderthal logic that men are the power and women the pure morals behind the men. no fair. im moral. i dont need no woman to tell me i shouldn't fight and drink to excess and curse. i want the door opened for me sometime. most of all...I WANT FREE DRINKS AND DINNER TO GET ME TO LAY A GAL! thats it, im becoming metrosexual. end of story.

your friendly neighborhood spikey-haired turtleboy who never agrees with heather on almost anything. search for the racist controversy surrounding my school on CNN! (Carnegie Mellon) some white boy put the "N-word" in print! golly forbid! PC bastards. Fascists! next youll be saying i cant print anti-asian sentiments and the word gook if i hate me and mine!

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sorry bonnie =) no more controversial items discussion with you. i was just notified by the hey-there council. i will only argue with anyone who wants to take issue with me. because i like controversy!

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I know the story of Hitler, yo. He was also afraid of homosexuals, and was actually believed to be homosexual. He was afraid of things he was. Wasn't his mom Jewish too? Or something... I forgot.

Annnyyywaaayyy...

Don't get me started on the injustices of the Native Americans. ;) My ppl suffered too!

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The doctor who tried to keep his sick mother alive was Jewish. Interestingly, when Hitler started rounding up the Jews into camps, he sought this guy out and let me leave the country unhurt.

Little tidbits from Western Civ come back to me at strange moments. :)

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alisatank.livejournal.com

i just wanted to say... if you write like the first couple paragraphs of this post, i think you are a beautiful writer :)

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Thanks. It was one of those stream-of-consciousness kind of posts.

Compliments like that really help to bolster my floundering writer's ego. :)

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